Discussion: FLOORING: An Industry In Crisis, by Lea MacDonald

[Chuck]

Lea,
I see lemonade where you see lemons. Let us examine your example. While you used the example of that tool as a way of proving that installation has become a more mentally taxing exercise; I look at it as one hell of an innovation! What method preceded the advent of your example? Putty?

Things get better every day. To me, the biggest problem on the immediate horizon is the blurring of lines between manufacturer, distributor and retailer.

As far as the future of installation, that is a bottom up deal. Organizations do not install product. Men do. There are no barriers between installers and information nowadays. It is up to the man who yearns to become excellent at what he does to make that goal a reality. I have never had a job as an installer. I never had anyone "send" me to get training. Nevertheless, I know more about this stuff than most men in the business. It was not an accident, and I ain't all that smart. I simply wanted to be the best.

While I have pretty much made twice what most installers make around here, it was not due to luck. I spend every day of of my life making myself a more valuable commodity. Yes, commodity.

[Lea MacDonald]

Hello Chuck, just got back from band practice, good to see you had time to pop in. Let's take a look.

I see lemonade where you see lemons. Let us examine your example. While you used the example of that tool as a way of proving that installation has become a more mentally taxing exercise; I look at it as one hell of an innovation! What method preceded the advent of your example? Putty?

You and I both view the tool the same way, a great innovation. And it's hard to say if putty was used before the introduction of this tool - to be sure, something was. I don't see installation as becoming more mentally taxing, I see it as something that requires the investment of more time to keep abreast of new innovations, techniques, and products.

Things get better every day. To me, the biggest problem on the immediate horizon is the blurring of lines between manufacturer, distributor and retailer.

This line is not so difficult if you look at it a certain way. This is one thing we came to understand in this industry . . . it rings true for other industries as well . . . and, by the way, this is the correct answer to the last question I asked: Those 3 entities are ALL channel partners. Not one of them is a customer. The customer is defined as the one making final use of any product sold. For instance, where I asked if I'd be a valued customer, the correct answer would have been that I might indeed be valued, but I'd not be your customer, I'd be a channel partner engaged in the distribution of your product offerings.

This was one huge area of disconnect in the industry when the Gallop group and the Industrial Performance Group examined it: the mills looked upon the retailers as their customers rather than channel partners. The mills were engaged in the business of satisfying the retailers who (wanted cheaper carpet) were then left the responsibility of satisfying the final consumer. The net result of which was carpet that was receiving less latex and more fillers and frothing agents, lighter face weights blown and fluffed to give the illusion of a better hand, and more staple yarn products.

The industry has entered a game called "Someone's margin has to give and it ain't gonna be mine." The mills protected their margin by reducing expensive components in the manufacturing process. The retailers got their cheap carpet and could maintain their margin. The installer however, recieved carpet that was getting harder and harder to work with, and the customer got a lesser quality product. When the consumer woke up to this fact - carpet was not performing like it once had - they started to migrate toward other products in droves, laminates, hardwood, ceramic and so on - self inflicted crisis.

While I have pretty much made twice what most installers make around here, it was not due to luck. I spend every day of of my life making myself a more valuable commodity. Yes, commodity.

If you consider yourself a dime-a-dozen commodity I'll not be able to change your mind. However, if you did something like taking a burning desire to be better than other also-rans, then you stepped outside being a commodity. Granted, you may be considered a commodity in short supply because you have more knowledge and dedication and drive than others, but you certainly stepped outside being a dime-a-dozen commodity selling dime-a-dozen commodities.

However, if you insist you're a dime-a-dozen commodity, then you'll not be able to shake that when selling products because, by association, they too will be considered commodities.

And thus we have the pervasive mentality in the flooring industry: everything is a commodity, pad, installation, and everything associated. And as consumers move closer to this understanding, the industry moves deeper into crisis.

Great discussion Chuck, really. Indeed, always a pleasure. Your desire to learn has been evident throughout our entire dialogue.

PS:

I have never had a job as an installer.

You never had a job as an installer? What was it you were greasy fast at then?

[harry bean]

Greetings oh wise men and women. New here and just wanted to comment.

While Lea's history lesson is correct I believe his revelations about how this industry is in a crisis is terribly wrong.

I lived this crisis. I lived the history lesson and believe me all the bad stuff that happened to me was a direct result of me not selling myself,. As an independant installer now, you better learn fast to sell yourself.

The manufactures knew exactly what they wanted when they wanted it. They wanted cheap labor -slamerjammer- on the floor and got exactly what they wanted. Retailers knew and do - keep labor low - dont care- attitude and still do. This is a crisis dreamed up by the manufacturing community. They got exactly what they wanted and deserved.

Does anyone here think the manufactures actually had to pay for any of that hacked in flooring? Really? I doubt it. So why all the screaming the sky is falling?

You can keep yourself out of this hypothetical crisis if you want to. Just be the best you can be. Do lots of research. People, all the information you will ever need is right in front of your finger tips. You just need to know how to find it. Actually these BB's are almost outdated in that purpose except just to chat with one another.

If you have any skill at all you can install just about anything you want to professionally. Albeit a little practice and research.

Aright I believe I said enough.,
Later

[Chuck]

Lea,

This discussion has devolved into a debate. I am in no position to educate anyone about the inner workings of carpet mills. That ain't my gig; and besides, I am talking about flooring, not carpet. Carpet and residential sheet are both losing market share to hard surface alternatives. This has more to with the increasing affordability of the latter than the general quality of the former.

I suppose I will recede from this intercourse, since it has morphed into you and me competing to "win" our common argument instead of attempting to come to a mutual understanding. The definition of the term "crisis" is apparently attitudinal in nature. Such is the case with all shifts in the market at large.

Keep on fightin' the good fight.

Your devoted servant,
CHU

[Chuck]

I must say that I find this sort of back and forth very enjoyable. Comforting, even. There is an immense pleasure to be found in intelligent conversation. While I disagree with many of Lea's opinions, at least they are genuine opinions. They are borne of thought and studious reflection. They are not verbal ejaculations based upon uninformed prejudice. That is quite refreshing. I will continue this discussion if asked to do so, but I have pretty much said all I have to say. I detest redundancy.

CHU

[Chuck]

p.s. Commodity means anything of value. Installation is a commodity just as everything people purchase is a commodity. There is no sane reason to consider that word or its true definition to be profane. To say that installation is a commodity is a simple realization of undeniable truths. Unfinished wood is also a commodity. That does not mean that select and #2 can be had for the same price.

In a multi-tiered market, there will always exist disparate levels of value associated with each level of competence required for a particular task. Competence will match demand. To make the imaginary jump between general competence and specific skillsets to defend an extrapolation based upon a personal belief in some egalitarian ethic is an effort based more in faith than in empericism.

It is a bottom up deal. Men make themselves better. Excellence can be forced about as efficiently as a string can be pushed.

I know of what I speak.

CHU

[Tandy Reeves]

Great discussion and points from all three of you. However, at what point does a crisis exist when 89% to a whopping 96% of everything we look at is a complaint because the product was not installed properly.

That is not because an inspector thinks it is wrong, but the book (installation instructions) say it is wrong.

[Peter Kodner]

I agree this discussion has been both infomative and entertaining.
I did copy dictionary.com definition of commodity:
1. Something useful that can be turned to commercial or other advantage: “Left-handed, power-hitting third basemen are a rare commodity in the big leagues” (Steve Guiremand).
2. An article of trade or commerce, especially an agricultural or mining product that can be processed and resold.
3. Advantage; benefit.
4. Obsolete. A quantity of goods.
Not sure if this clarifies anything, but I always like to hear someone other than my own definitions of words...

Lea & Chuck, please continue this thread.

BTW I think Tandy is right on with what our role as inspectors is. "Just the facts, Ma'am, Just the facts." Sgt. Friday, Dragnet.

[Lea MacDonald]

Tandy Reeves said Great discussion and points from all three of you. However, at what point does a crisis exist when 89% to a whopping 96% of everything we look at is a complaint because the product was not installed properly. That is not because an inspector thinks it is wrong, but the book (installation instructions) say it is wrong.

Hello Tandy, thank you for your comment. The notion that an inspector has relative job security these days, to me, is testament to the fact things are not all that well in this industry - you see it first hand every day.

The point at the heart of my article is really one of installation. If a industry segment does not have the ability to satisfy consumers then that industry is in crisis. Although an elementary observation, it rings very true.

25% of my calls are either to start (or complete) a difficult installation or repair it. The repairs I see are as you pointed out, installation related. The reality is that all my calls should be for installation, period. And I'm not alone in my observation. I've plumbed other older installers in this area and they are getting repair calls as well.

While I won't argue repairs are a part of what we do, I do contend that being invited to view catastophic screw ups should not typical to this industry. And while one may contend that these screw ups happen in other industires, such a statement is nothing more than a blanket statement used for generalizing. Electricians have standards and codes they have to go by, many in the installation community consider their guidelines and standards mere suggestions.

The net result of screwing up a customer's material is one of disatisfaction. If only 10% of those who have material installed are experiencing installation problems, it simply does not bode well for the industry, and by logical extension is one of the building blocks for a crisis.

Again, thank you for your comments.

[Steve Olson]

Sorry Peter K, I must take issue "that left handed, power hitting third basemen are a commodity.."A right handed, power hitting third baseman , who bats from the left side, now, THATS a commodity. Lefties are good for 1st, right, and pitching.

[harry bean]

I was sold as a commodity. I was sold cheap. Expected to install it asap worry about problems later. As long a the retailer is in control of the money for labor thats the way it will always be. And thats fine with me. I sell education -- installation excellence and myself included. I knew integrity before any org ever looked up the word. Dont let anyone sell you cheap.

[Lea MacDonald]

harry bean said I was sold as a commodity. I was sold cheap. Expected to install it asap worry about problems later. As long a the retailer is in control of the money for labor thats the way it will always be. And thats fine with me. I sell education -- installation excellence and myself included. I knew integrity before any org ever looked up the word. Dont let anyone sell you cheap.

A note to others with regard of my use of the word commodity . . . was with regard to a common commodity, and instrument of trade - labor for dollars. This was lost on some.

Harry, you are quite right, when one sells themselves cheap they have reduced their stock in trade to the lowest common denominator, price. In such an instance the value and benefits that go hand in glove with paying more for a better service go out the window.

When an industry views labor as a cost of business, something to be negotiated down, an evil byproduct of commerce then that industry is on the road of crisis.

An apt analogy might be gravity. Though gravity may not be part of one's belief system or play any part in one's religion or world view, it impacts us every day. So too does the watering down of value associated with excellent craftsmanship.

The very reason you can sell education and installation excellence plays further testament to the fact that what you sell is needed out there.

Nice post.

[Bud Cline]

Here's something from the "For What It's Worth Department."

This thread has now begun to veer sharply off course and for the sake of maintaining focus I'm thinking one of you guys should start a new thread about training and seminars (or the lack thereof) and not continue the current conversation trend in this thread. The last couple of posts should/could be moved to a new thread to start it off. I'm thinking there is a lot to be said about the educational channels that are made available to those of us that care to participate but unfortunately "that" topic will be lost if it continues here.

Moderators? Anyone agree?

[TFP Admin]

The thread has been split and you will find the new topic here: Educationional opportunities Please do continue with any dicussion about the article here in this thread, but discussion about educational opportunities in the new one.

Thank you.

[Jerry LA Tile]

I agree Lea, Very interesting and informative article. Gives me something to look forward to in my new career of choice Hahahaha. As we say in the south "Aint Skeerd" . Not as long as I have you guys around