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Installing underlayment over concrete?



"Installing underlayment over concrete?," in the Floor Preparation forum, begins: "I live in a condo building with a concrete subfloor in good shape. I'd like to install Novalis vinyl tile ..."

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Old October 14, 2010, 02:44 PM   #1
cando35
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Installing underlayment over concrete?


I live in a condo building with a concrete subfloor in good shape. I'd like to install Novalis vinyl tile planks from Lowes, but the building requires an underlayment to ensure an IIC rating of at least 50. What options do I have? I'd like to keep the underlayment as thin as possible, as the floor to ceiling height is already short as it is. And obviously I'd like to keep the costs as low as possible too. Any help would be appreciated

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Old October 14, 2010, 05:12 PM   #2
Mike Sahli
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cando35 said View Post
I live in a condo building with a concrete subfloor in good shape. I'd like to install Novalis vinyl tile planks from Lowes, but the building requires an underlayment to ensure an IIC rating of at least 50. What options do I have? I'd like to keep the underlayment as thin as possible, as the floor to ceiling height is already short as it is. And obviously I'd like to keep the costs as low as possible too. Any help would be appreciated
I don't remember if the Novalis planks are glue down or not, if they are its tough to find a underlayment with a known IIC rating but some one here may know of one.

Lowes also has a floating LVT that you could install over Konecto cushion, when combined with Konecto floating LVT it has a IIC rating well over 50 so it would probably have the same benefit under the Lowes floating LVT.

Does the condo board require documentation on the IIC rating ? If it does you may want to consider going with the Konecto product and Konecto cushion.

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Old October 14, 2010, 07:12 PM   #3
cando35
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The Novalis are peel and stick. The condo board does require documentation of the IIC rating.

There seem to be a lot of comments about issues with the Konecto tiles coming up. Since I was looking to do this myself, instead of hiring an installer, how concerned should I be?

Are there other options/suggestions that might be less risky for a self-installer?

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Old October 14, 2010, 07:23 PM   #4
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You could try a product like Jumpax, not that hard to work with really and will meet the IIC rating you need. They have a video to show you how to install it.

Jumpax

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Old October 14, 2010, 07:29 PM   #5
cando35
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What about VC300? (Official Website for VC300 Underlay for Vinyl Resilient Flooring) Would that work with peel and stick type tiles, or is a floating underlayment better?

I was also looking into cushioned vinyl tiles that I could apply directly to the concrete, but was having trouble finding IIC ratings for them. Any suggestions in that direction?

Thanks for your help!

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Old October 14, 2010, 08:15 PM   #6
Mike Sahli
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cando35 said View Post
What about VC300? (Official Website for VC300 Underlay for Vinyl Resilient Flooring) Would that work with peel and stick type tiles, or is a floating underlayment better?

I was also looking into cushioned vinyl tiles that I could apply directly to the concrete, but was having trouble finding IIC ratings for them. Any suggestions in that direction?

Thanks for your help!
I didn't see a IIC rating for VC300

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Old October 14, 2010, 09:40 PM   #7
stullis
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Just say no to the peel and stick.

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Old October 14, 2010, 10:25 PM   #8
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Maybe its late but what does IIC mean?

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Old October 15, 2010, 04:48 AM   #9
cando35
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Impact insulation class- it's a sound rating.

Could I just use plywood as an underlayment for the novalis tiles? Would I need some type of barrier between the plywood and concrete? Most of the install instructions of the various tile types indicate that the warranty is void if you install the tiles on plywood that is installed directly over concrete.

I like the idea of the floating LVT, but if one piece gets damaged I believe it is difficult to replace just one without destroying those around it. Or am I mistaken?

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Old October 15, 2010, 04:56 AM   #10
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It is never a good idea to put plywood on concrete.

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Old October 15, 2010, 05:58 AM   #11
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If you put a 6 mil (I would use nothing less than 8 mil) plastic between the concrete slab and the ply that will work. NWFA allows wood floors installed in this manner.

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Old October 15, 2010, 06:02 AM   #12
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cando35 said View Post
I live in a condo building with a concrete subfloor in good shape. I'd like to install Novalis vinyl tile planks from Lowes, but the building requires an underlayment to ensure an IIC rating of at least 50. What options do I have? I'd like to keep the underlayment as thin as possible, as the floor to ceiling height is already short as it is. And obviously I'd like to keep the costs as low as possible too. Any help would be appreciated
The obvious question that no one has yet asked!! What is down now??

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Old October 15, 2010, 06:22 AM   #13
cando35
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Right now I have carpet, and it really needs to go (Chicago winters and my dog have done a number on it )

I guess the more I research it seems like my best option for a DIY would be a floating LVT over a sound-muffling underlayment. I've looked at the Konecto, though am I correct that it can only be ordered online? I'm not finding any stores in the Chicago area stating they sell it. Is there another floating LVT that is a good compromise between cost and durability that you would recommend to check out? I'm guessing I want at least a .3mm wear layer, right?

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Old October 15, 2010, 06:28 AM   #14
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Tandy Reeves said View Post
If you put a 6 mil (I would use nothing less than 8 mil) plastic between the concrete slab and the ply that will work. NWFA allows wood floors installed in this manner.
Tandy, what happens with the moisture that gets trapped under the plastic?

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Old October 15, 2010, 07:09 AM   #15
Mike Sahli
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cando35 said View Post
Right now I have carpet, and it really needs to go (Chicago winters and my dog have done a number on it )

I guess the more I research it seems like my best option for a DIY would be a floating LVT over a sound-muffling underlayment. I've looked at the Konecto, though am I correct that it can only be ordered online? I'm not finding any stores in the Chicago area stating they sell it. Is there another floating LVT that is a good compromise between cost and durability that you would recommend to check out? I'm guessing I want at least a .3mm wear layer, right?
Armstrong Luxe is a flaoting LVT plank that you could put over the Konecto cushion, I don't know if you can get it by the condo board or not but I would bet the IIC rating would be the same as using the Konecto.

You should be able to find Armstrong everywhere.

"Mils" of wear layer is different from " mm " and most wear layers are rated in Mils of thickness, the more Mils the better with 6 Mils being the minimum I would say and Urethane on top of that is much better.

If you need to convert Mils to mm. Mils x .0254 = mm
mm to Mils would be, mm / .0254 = Mils

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