Another "Where to Start" Solicitation

[resoron]

Hi,

Just found this forum and have found lots of interesting and useful information so far. I am about to start installation of a new hardwood floor in my house and would like to get some forum input on where to start. The product is pre-finished engineered bamboo that will be nailed down over rosin paper. The subfloor is plywood and the joists run perpendicular to the long axis of the house. I have attached a diagram showing the floorplan. All the rooms will be hardwood (except the bathrooms) and I would like to run the floor from room to room without a break in it (no transition pieces). Any thoughts on:

- Where to start? My inclination is to start down the hall either along the long wall shared with the kitchen (interrupted by many doors) or at the bull nose piece which will be at the top of the stairs. I would then work in both directions into the rooms.

- What problems can I anticipate going into the bedrooms? Particularly since the entries into the bedrooms are like small hallways. I'm concerned about coming in from the doorway and working my way into the room and keeping things straight. Is this something to worry about? Any tips on how to put control lines in these rooms to help with layout?

- How tricky will flowing the floor through the kitchen and dining room be? That is, I have a couple of walls that I will have to fill around and then have the floor come back together in the doorway between the kitchen and dining room. I was thinking I would put a control line parallel to a line down the hall to measure to while installing. Any tips on keeping this straight?

those are the big questions right now but I'm sure more will come up. Thanks in advance and look forward to your comments.

[Jerry Thomas]

Welcome resoron, I would suggest you start in the hallway at the stair nosing and get that part out of the way.

Continuing into adjacent rooms is really a non issue if one is careful. What you need to watch for is the far inside corner. I usually stop at the opening and measure out to opposite wall and then go down to inside corner end and measure from the opposite wall back to the corner then pop a line along those marks.

You have one wraparound and there is where you will need to be extra cautious. Do that control line deal like you mentioned and as you work up to the line use some decent boards and try not to use too many shorts through there until you meet up again. Also coming through the kitchen be sure to measure back from the control line to inside corners under cabinets. Cabinets toe-kicks are notorious for being out of square.

[cproader]

.....there's never anything left fer us to say after Jerry gets through postin....and he gets up so early ya can't beat him to the punch.....

[Floorguy]

Yep, do the staircase first, if your going to do the stairs, and then the top stairnose, and then all the way down the hall into the office, and into the living room, the otherway.

[resoron]

Hey, thanks everyone for the responses. The stairs will be carpeted so I only have to worry about the top tread (thankfully).

So, the stair tread has a groove and is longer than the width of the stair. Do I cut it to length, cut a groove in both ends and use slip tongues to mate it to the rest of the floor? I was planning on face nailing the tread toward the lip and then nailing through the slip tongue with the floor nailer. Is this correct/best practice? Should it be glued instead/also?

The width of the tread will put it out into the hallway a couple of inches. The floor boards are 5" wide so I will end up ripping the first row along the wall adjacent to the top of the stair in the hall. Anything to watch out for here? I do have access to a table saw, jointer, band saw etc. so the cutting shouldn't be an issue.

One other question (not the last I'm sure ). When face nailing with a nailer, is there a certain type of nail I should be using? Usually people just say "face nail" or "finish nail" but should I be using finish nails or can you get ring or shank nails for pneumatic nailers (my only experience with nailers has been for trim work)?

Thanks again. Always nice to find a place with helpful, friendly folks.

Ron

[Nick Arrera]

Welcome to TFP resoron ..
i put a bead of PL 400 under the stair nose , and blind nail it into the spline ..
I use a 16 ga finish nail for the air gun to face nail and putty the hole .. you can pick up a little jar for $2.00 at HD ..

[Floorguy]

Glue and top nail the nosing. Spline or buscuit the nose, come straight off it with a full board of flooring, and back fill the sides, where the nosing sticks out into the hall.

[Jerry Thomas]

Ron, just to keep us all legal we are supposed to be using a 15 ga. 2" finish nail for face nailing. I use a 16 ga. like Nick because it makes a little smaller hole to putty over. Some guys taught me a few years ago to place face nails in the darker grained areas, they will almost disappear that way. I also glue and nail the nosing.

Is that a wall or a guardrail separating the stairs and living room?

[Peter Kodner]

resoron, glad you found us and you have some some great practical advice from some real pros!

2 quick items:

You are not installing a hardwood floor. Bamboo is not wood, it is grass. It has good and bad characteristics but I presume you have done your own research on the product.

I would recommend using 15# saturated felt, or even better Aquabar, instead of rosin paper. The felt will provide a vapor retarder; the Aquabar a vapor barrier; the rosin paper neither. Bamboo will surprise you in it's reaction to moisture change.

[resoron]

Thanks again everyone. I'll glue and nail the stair nose.

Peter, You got me on the bamboo. I am aware of the positives and negatives but like the look. We are using an engineered (i.e. plywood like structure) bamboo which should help with movement and moisture susceptibility. I did put a sealant/primer on the floor (B-I-N) since the previous owners had dogs who had left their mark on the carpets. I looked into Aquabar and think I will use that instead of the rosin paper for an added barrier. Thanks for the suggestion.

Jerry, that's a wall so I don't have to worry about wrapping the stair nose.

Can't wait to get started. This weekend will be doing a dry run of putting the control lines down and verifying everything. Hopefully next weekend I'll start. This day job sure makes this a slow process, but I gotta pay for it somehow

Thanks again,
Ron

[cproader]

.....go get'em Ron. I'm sure yer gonna do a good job and it will be so rewardin, yer gonna wanna do it again..............wiat......don't be gettin too good at it er we wont have nothin to do.......

[resoron]

You knew I would be back didn't you

Well, I took a look at the layout at the top of the stair and there is a bit of a challenge. If I start at the stair nose (recall this is pre-finished with a micro-bevel) I end up with a gap of about 1" against the opposite wall. I have included a sketch with a detail. The stair nose is shown with dashed lines. I thought about moving the stair nose back toward the opposite wall where the gap is (routing the lip of the stair) but then the other problem comes up. If I move the stair nose back, the bull nose comes short of the wall and looks terrible. I'm not sure if this is clear (a digital camera would be nice, I'll have to get one sometime). Right now my solution is to add a trim that frames the stair nose that would be sized to fill the opposite gap.

How would a Pro solve the problem??

Thanks in advance,
Ron

[cproader]

I would add a couple layers of drywall to the exsisting to build it out.............

I personally would just notch the first run around the stairnose and regroove the board to accept the slip tongue..........but there are some different opinions, I'm sure.......