Thinking of installing hardwood floors myself

[samaursa]

Hi,

I just moved into a relatively new house (it is 4 years old). I want to install hardwood flooring, tongue and groove on the first floor. The carpet by the previous owners was not cared for and I already tore it off. I am either going to get Home Depot to install new carpet for me, or install hardwood flooring myself. I am more inclined towards the hardwood flooring.

The sub floor is similar to particle board. I was thinking of putting 3/4 plywood planks on top of the flooring, nail it down and then install the hardwood. There is no way I can tear out the sub floor since it is running through the other rooms and it is very thick.

Any suggestions, tips etc. on how to go about doing this?

Thank you!

[Kman]

Is there any way you could cut the particle board at each place where your new hardwood begins/ends and remove it, then replace it with 3/4 ply?

Since the layer of 3/4 ply you're wanting to install should not be nailed through to the floor joists, you can only nail to the particle board, and it doesn't hold a nail very well. Every house I've worked on where I've found particle board, I tear it out.

[Nick Arrera]

Welcome to the site samaursa .. Agree with K Man , it doesn't have the holding power .. what ever you do stay away from HD .. I can tell you horror stories you would not believe .. if you can not remove the sub floor , recommend you use at least 5/8 " plywood ,
glueing with PL400 that you can get in a tube at HD , and nailing it every 4 to 6 " in the field , and every other inch on the edges ..

[Floorguy]

Particle board "like"

This could be Oriented Strand Board(OSB)

Can't see real particle board used in a 4 year old home.

If it is in fact OSB, install over it using staples, not cleats.

[tony lamar]

Particle board would be a definate no no. It can be removed with a sawzall though. I'm betting it's more likely some type of osb, Advantek maybe. Especially if it's a single layer subfloor system. I can't imagine anyone using particle board as a single layer.

[samaursa]

Thank you all for your replies!

It is a Oriented Strand Board (I saw the same thing in home depot). Does that change anything? I mean, can I install the 3/4 plywood on top of it with staples or do you still recommend tearing it down?. I am going with the minimum thickness because of the height I'd gain if I go over. Right now, if I go with 3/4 and hardwood, the floor height will still be greater than the tiles in the kitchen and eating area. Which leads me to another questions. If the floor height is going to be a bit more than the tiles in the kitchen/eating area, are there ways to ease up the transition from the hardwood to the tiles?

Thank you!

[Kman]

How much difference in height is there right now between the OSB and the tile?

[Daniel Wachtel]

Let's start with the construction of the tile floor. If your subfloor is OSB your tile is probably installed on cementitious backer units (like hardi backer or durock) With thinset under the CBU panels and thinset under the tile. Installing hardwood directly on your OSB should have two relatively even surfaces. Leave a uniform gap about 1/4" to 3/8 " and use a "grout caulk" (sanded caulking color matched to your tile grout) between the two to allow the two floors to move independently of one another.

[Jerry Thomas]

samaursa, if the OSB is a 3/4" T&G subfloor grade you are good to go as far as installing hardwood without adding a plywood underlayment. Staples are better than cleats for installing the solid hardwood flooring over 3/4" OSB. Daniel gave you excellent advice for transitioning to tile.

[samaursa]

Thank you for the replies!

I am currently without internet at my new address so my replies are slow. I am going to measure the height difference between the OSB and the tile, but I think it is around an inch, maybe a little less (which is why I am a little worried about the height difference).

I am more inclined to using 3/4 plywood because a lot of people have warned me about hardwood directly over the floor boards if the floor boards are not plywood already. I will measure today and will let you guys know the height difference before and approximate height difference after the installation.

I also want hardwood the stairs. Does anybody have any experience with that? I am assuming I'll have to remove the railing... how do I go about that? Also, the bottom most stair has a rounded edge on one side rather than being a rectangle like the other stairs. And how do I actually lay out the hardwood on the stairs? What do I do with the edges?

Last couple of questions are, what tools should I get and which ones should I rent? I already have a circular saw, and am planning to buy a compressor, a nail gun and a jigsaw. The hardwood nailer I am planning on renting. Any other tools I should be buying/renting that I won't simply be able to do without?

Thank you very much!

[samaursa]

ok, so I bought half inch plywood and maple hardwood which is no acclimatizing in the rooms where it is going to go. Should I nail them or should I staple the hardwood? The strips are 2 1/4 width wise. The height is standard as other hardwoods (3/4).

When I am nailing in the plywood, is there a specific spacing of the nails that I should follow? Or should I screw it in instead (and again, what spacing rule should I follow?)

Thank you!

[Floorguy]

Maple is a mover, cleats may be a better choice, depending on your yearly climate and the ambient conditions inside the home. The wood shold be nailed about 8-12 inches apart and no closer then 2inches from the ends to prevent tongue splitting. The ¾ plywood underlayment needs to be screwed to the plywood subfloor decking, 6-8 inches in the field and 4inches on the edges. using 1¼ inch screws. You may want to glue the underlayment to the subfloor, along with the screws.

[samaursa]

Thanks for the tips!

You said "... no closer than 2 inches from the ends...". You mean the ends length wise right?
____________________
|___________________|

<--->----------------<--->
2 inches---------------2 inches

Please let me know if I understood wrong.

Also, I am going to be nailing and gluing the first row which is adjacent to the kitchen tiles so that it is strong as that is the area which will get hit from time to time and I don't want it to budge. Do you recommend otherwise? Btw, is there a rule against not using screws on hardwood (on the first couple of rows where the nailer can't reach)?

The plywood that I bought is 1/2 inch. Since there is a recession in the floor, which measure to about half an inch, I thought I'd add the plywood over the OSB and then the floor height will be 3/4 including the hardwood (basically, the height of the hardwood).

Daniel, I was going to go with your advice but obviously with the plywood, there is going to be a height difference. I am going to use reducers (which I am going to order today). Any tips on how to install them? I was advised to start from the tile end when installing the hardwood, installing the reducer first, then the first row, and then move all the way to the end wall.

Another question that came to my mind when you mentioned climate floorguy, is that I live in Canada. During winters, I'll keep the house warm to certain degrees at all times, but during the summer I will not turn on the A/C all the time, especially when I am not home. Will high temperatures ruin the wood (buckling?) after I install it?

Thank you!

[Peter Kodner]

Here is what the specification from NWFA is:

Wood Flooring Type:
Solid Strip T&G
3/4" less than 3"

Fastener to be used:
1 1/2"-2" fastener, or 6d-8d casing or finsh nails.

Fastener spacing:
Blind fastener spacing along the lengths of the strips, minimum 2 fasteners per piece near the ends (1-3"). In addition, every 6-8" apart for blind nailing, 10-12" for face nailing.

If you have a moisture meter, let us know what your temperature and relative humidity readings are along with the moisture content readings (three per strip). If you can provide your square footage, we can give you an idea how many strips to check.

I totally agree with Floorguy on cleats for this one. Long term, cleats will be superior to staples. After a few shrink/swell cycles, cleats will have better holding power. The 2" from the ends spacing is a very good practice for this job too.

Make sure you observe your expansion space requirements at all vertical surfaces: 3/4".

You are definitely going to want to get a screw gun for the underlayment

[Nick Arrera]

You can get a RH > Temp meter at HD for around $20.00 .. Set it on the floor for 1/2 hour then record the reading ..