Janka Scale

Ken · June 24, 2009, 07:51 PM

And none of them know that the rating is for solid wood and has no bearing on engineered products.

Peter Kodner · June 24, 2009, 08:28 PM

or bamboo...

FlooringGirl · June 24, 2009, 08:31 PM

Yes, what it comes down to is that wood is wood. Even if it has 12 coats of aluminum oxide coating, it's still able to be scratched and gouged. If the grandkid throws down a toy in a temper tantrum, you'll get a dink. If you drag the fridge across it, you'll get a gouge.

I once had a home with black walnut window casings. Now that was some tough stuff to drill holes in (for window treaatments). I broke lots of bits. That stuff is really hard! For the most part, wood needs special care, and I inform my customers of this. If they choose not to listen, it upsets me.

Tia

GaryS · June 25, 2009, 01:06 AM

I've had the same experience with Walnut where a pneumatic portanailer would not work on it and only fired 3/4 of the way in yet according to the janka scale and comments made here it is soft ?

Peter Kodner · June 25, 2009, 09:18 AM

Red Oak: 1290 (benchmark standard)
American Black Walnut: 1010
I am surprised to hear about nailing problems with it. Have you checked your gun and compressor? There is a big preference for staples here but I'm still an advocate for cleats. Which are you using?

Dan Schultz · June 25, 2009, 11:36 AM

[QUOTE=Peter Kodner;68649]Red Oak: 1290 (benchmark standard)
American Black Walnut: 1010
QUOTE]

I think benchmark standard is a good way to put that Peter.

Of course, that would be a benchmark standard for North American Black Walnut as well. We have no idea what part of the country the samples tested came from. I don't know but I'd guess there is a difference in that beautiful chocolate brown stuff that grows in NE Oklahoma and what grows in the rest of the USA.

GaryS · June 25, 2009, 02:10 PM

It was a hired machine so the shop it was hired from tested it and even tried a larger compressor it may well be that it was a faulty machine though. I generally hire a portanailer and use cleats though I have a Paslode stapler just never thought about using it for hardwood or even if this type of stapler can be used.

FlooringGirl · June 29, 2009, 09:23 PM

Maybe it makes a difference that the black walnut I was trying to drill into was from a house built in 1914? And, I really have no idea where it grew, came from?

My home before that was built in 1900 with red oak trim, and it was much better to work with, easier to drill into.

Tia

Peter Kodner · June 30, 2009, 09:27 AM

Dan Schultz said

I think benchmark standard is a good way to put that Peter.

Of course, that would be a benchmark standard for North American Black Walnut as well. We have no idea what part of the country the samples tested came from. I don't know but I'd guess there is a difference in that beautiful chocolate brown stuff that grows in NE Oklahoma and what grows in the rest of the USA.

Different soil, different minerals in the ground, different characteristics. I' sure Dan knows better than most the differences between northern and southern red oak!

rusty baker · June 30, 2009, 11:53 AM

My house was built in 1908 and all the studs and joists are black walnut. I've never seen anything that hard. From the way some of the rafters are bowed, I'd say it was used green. I know most of the houses here built with oak were put up green.

Dan Schultz · June 30, 2009, 03:58 PM

Rusty, I'd say that probably has to do with the timber being old growth. No telling how old the trees were back in those days.

GaryS · July 2, 2009, 01:49 AM

Hi Dan

I would say that made sense if not for having fitted a new American Black Walnut floor recently and this stuff was as hard as nails as well.

Walnut although according to Janka scale is softer than oak in reality it is harder to work with, it is both harder to cut and harder to nail.

Without doing exhaustive research on the properties of different species of tree and hence flooring I was wondering what the experiences of the forum members were on using different types of wood and if there is other guides like the Janka scale that an installer can refer to for info about the properties of the floor.

ie. The dust from cutting Brazillian Walnut (IPE) can cause an allergic reaction something I only found out recently.

rusty baker · July 2, 2009, 06:32 AM

Not surprised that walnut can cause an allergic reaction. Did you know that something about walnut trees poison the ground and you cannot raise tomatoes near them. The local agriculture extension told us that's why our big tomato plants bear no tomatoes.

Peter Kodner · July 2, 2009, 09:46 AM

GaryS, you could join NWFA and receive all of their technical publications (comes with membership). The Wood Species booklet will provide much of the info you are asking for here. I'm not a fan of the group but have been a member several times in the past. National Wood Flooring Association - Consumers Source For Wood Flooring Professionals

I would also visit the site for Forest Products Lab. It is a division of the U.S. Dept. of Agriculture and you can download a great deal of info there for free. Forest Products Laboratory - USDA Forest Service

It will require some effort to read through all of it, but worth your time.

GaryS · July 2, 2009, 12:53 PM

Hi Peter

Thanks for your reply not so sure how NWFA will work with me being in the UK but will have a look at the site anyway. Hardwood flooring seems to be more common in the States maybe because of the lousy climate we have over here most of the time. It is more common to see laminates here though I would say I am starting to see a shift towards solids.