What would you change about the carpet installation standards?

[Lo Down]

BrianM said ****************************** ** It's kind of ironic for me as a union worker to see this. We've always had those programs and standards, for well over a hundred years----yet some guys still suck.

That about says it all. I know someone who hasn't gotten any better at this trade, and like me, he's been doing this since 1975.

If anything, the mills and distributors need to put an installation flier in ever roll that gets shipped out. Grandpa never sealed seams. One day I was reading the info from a flier inside roll we were working on and it said no seam issue will be honored if the seam wasn't sealed......... we started sealing seam edges at that point. That was in the late '70s.
If I hadn't read that, I wouldn't have ever known it was needed.

[BrianM]

Lo Down said That about says it all. I know someone who hasn't gotten any better at this trade, and like me, he's been doing this since 1975. If anything, the mills and distributors need to put an installation flier in ever roll that gets shipped out. Grandpa never sealed seams. One day I was reading the info from a flier inside roll we were working on and it said no seam issue will be honored if the seam wasn't sealed......... we started sealing seam edges at that point. That was in the late '70s. If I hadn't read that, I wouldn't have ever known it was needed.

****************************
Just about the best advice I was given by a journeyman was to read every piece of literature I could get my hands on. There was no internet and you wouldn't find anything relevant at the local library so if you only read the product info on the boxes, rolls and buckets you knew more than 95% of the other tradesmen in the field. Now with the internet, various certification programs and industry training that's probably changed. Now if you read the instructions you'd just be ahead of 94%. (g)

[mcurrin]

With the recent changes to the standard I think it should be scrapped, and start over. This is an industry specific standard and IICRC and ANSI are not in this industry. They have no business setting standards, for carpet installers.

Mike

[rusty baker]

mcurrin said With the recent changes to the standard I think it should be scrapped, and start over. This is an industry specific standard and IICRC and ANSI are not in this industry. They have no business setting standards, for carpet installers. Mike

I agree 100%. That's why I complained about the CRI's.

[kwfloors]

mcurrin said With the recent changes to the standard I think it should be scrapped, and start over. This is an industry specific standard and IICRC and ANSI are not in this industry. They have no business setting standards, for carpet installers. Mike

So you don't think carpet cleaners repair carpet? Guess again, they are doing more than you know. If you knew anything about how the ansi process works and who the people on the committee making the new guidelines are you wouldn't open your mouth and say such a thing.

[Dobby Tappet]

The IICRC is simply the vehicle moving the document forward. The drafting committees for the newly proposed standards are compromised of an equally represented cross section of our industry.

The standards, once drafted, via, not by, rather through, the IICRC, will be submitted and adopted by ANSI. The real teeth of the documents are not ANSI, but what ANSI will do with it. Because, in turn, ANSI will pass the document to the ISO. Once accepted and adopted by the ISO it will be 'the' standard by which all installations will be measured.

In the mean time, all installation training and certification, both union and non-union, will be revised and adapted to enable compliance to the new ANSI / ISO standards. This is not an idea, this is real. This is not coming, it is happening as we write, right here, right now. Whether we approve, or not and it will alter the future of our trade.

Respectfully,

Dobby

[rusty baker]

And if it is like the standards for other trades, there will be glaring omissions and mistakes, that we will be expected to comply with just like the current standards.

[mcurrin]

kwfloors said So you don't think carpet cleaners repair carpet? Guess again, they are doing more than you know. If you knew anything about how the ansi process works and who the people on the committee making the new guidelines are you wouldn't open your mouth and say such a thing.

By definition, IICRC are in the CLEANING industry. The fact that they do some repairs is incidental and most of the level of knowledge of installation is non existent. They should not be involved in writing standards for an entirely different trade. The absents of effective standards in this industry has left the door open to them. They also clean furniture, hard surfaces, walls, blinds, duct work and on and on. Why are they not setting standards for these other industries. Why only carpet? Would you let the guy at the car wash set standards for tires?????? That is what is happening.

So tell me who the top installers are on the committee and maybe I'll shut up.



Mike

[rgfloor]

Some that I have heard of:

James Mullins/Shaw
Bruce Gentry/Mohawk
Jon Namba/WFCA
and of course
Jim Walker

[Dobby Tappet]

Dan Westcott and Jack Dean from INSTALL to keep the CFI Poo-Ba-aahs in line.

Dobby

[mcurrin]

Ok I will back track some. I just don't want installers left out in the cold when this thing hits. I have more faith in CRI than I do in IICRC. Ansi well I won't go there.

Mike

[rgfloor]

Who is representing the Inspectors?

I volunteered by e-mailing James Mullins, he said he would forward my name but I never heard anything.

[Dobby Tappet]

Roger, you need to get a hold of CFI Master Installer & IICRC Inspector Barry Costa. Barry now resides in Arizona. If you need contact information you can PM me.

By the way, it is my understanding, and I heard this directly, that all requests to contribute to the drafting of the new standards are not only going to be accepted, but welcomed.

Respectfully,

Dobby

[Peter Kodner]

Dobby, would you forward it to me as well? I would like to volunteer as well.

[TFP Admin]

This topic drifted away from its intended focus. If you want to talk about certifications, that discussion has been moved here: http://www.thefloorpro.com/community...facations.html

Now this topic can continue with the discussion of the new carpet installation standards and whether you would change them (and how).

Jim